Thread

We just got a pretty major grant from a thing called Octant and the Ethereum Foundation to produce a documentary about the DOJβ€˜s case against Roman Storm. Probably gonna get lynched for this, but I think we need to talk. While we are grateful for every donation, over the past ~1.5 years we received noticably less donations in Bitcoin than we received in ETH, Zcash and Monero over the course of just a few months - while our main audience *are* bitcoiners. The only way I can explain this to myself is that there seems to be an issue with the general mentality of trying to keep your bitcoin to yourself, which results in a significant lack of support for others - and it makes me really sad. The way the Ethereum community is supporting the tornado cash developers is nothing short of extraordinary. Compare that to our support of Samourai, who collected a mere few 100k, while Roman Storm raised millions to fund his case. At the same time we end up wondering why most people in bitcoin are retarded orange tie maxis that treat BTC like just another stonk, and why its use as a tool for the people falls more and more behind in the global narrative. Its time we start taking better care of each other in this space, and I hope that next time one of us is criminally indicted, we support them with all that we have.

Replies (106)

I think one reason for the lack of support for the samourai team is because a lot of people don't like them. From what I have heard, the samourai team were assholes and they were drawing a lot of unnecessary attention to themselves. They were marketing their service as a way to navigate around government sanctions. I'm not saying they deserve what happened to them by any means. They did not. But you need to be smarter than that. This world isn't free and the freedoms we were taught that America stood for is simply a lie. The government made an example out of them and showed the world that this isn't about justice at all. It's about keeping people afraid and in line. I also think bitcoiner actions are more aligned with their beliefs than shitcoiners. Many bitcoiners are true anarchists who know that the government and all their courts are just smoke and mirrors. Shitcoiners need the government to play nice with them. Bitcoiners do not. Why would an anarchist ever try to gain freedom through a court that he doesn't perceive to be legitimate? Why would an anarchist pay a lawyer to try and free someone when he doesn't recognize their authority at all? The truth is that there is no real justice in these courts. Samourai had no speedy trial. They didn't have any clear violations of the law. They didn't actually custody any of the money. They were arrested before the prosecutors even finished building a case against them. Trying to free them by bending the knee and engaging in their bullshit lawyer spectacles is not how you gain freedom. The founding fathers didn't gain their freedom by arguing for it in rigged British courts. Freedom is not won that way. And the system is rigged. We know this. What happened to Ross Ulbricht is proof of that. What is happening with the Epstein files is proof of that. The prison sentence that Larken Rose received is proof of that. The prison sentence that Irwin Schiff received is proof of that. How much more evidence do people need before they stop wasting their time on these courts? This trial is not about justice or convicting criminals. It's about punishing people who are undermining the power of the government and the trials are just a show intended to maintain a pretense of fairness. That is the sole reason why courts exist. It's not about justice but making you think there is justice and that you need government to ensure justice prevails. The government can and does make examples out of the loud people who bring a lot of attention to themselves. The people trying to disrupt the system. Again, not saying they deserve what happened but asking me to pay lawyers to play a silly game of arguing about trivialities like what constitutes custody is not a good use of time or money. Is code speech? Is it a weapon? Is bitcoin protected under the first or second amendment? Wtf are these retarded arguments? Mental gymnastics is not how you become free. Americans don't know what it means to be American or free anymore. Finally, and most importantly, you can't beat the courts because it is tilted in their favor. The judge literally cannot be impartial when the state pays his salary. This fact alone makes everything that the court does unjust. And a jury of your peers who were coerced into being a jury is not justice either. A jury can't ensure justice when their basic human rights are being violated through coercive force. A jury that doesn't want to be in the court is not who I want to determine the fate of my freedom. Freedom isn't won this way. It never was and it never will be. This is just my best guess as to why bitcoiners are different. You may disagree with me, but I don't think any massive changes will be made through fraudulent kangaroo courts. And I have a hunch that after covering all this, you probably think the same. Should I waste my money on a lost cause? I don't think so. You are one of the few people on nostr that I consistently zap. It's because I appreciate your work and find it very valuable to keep up to date with the crimes that are being committed by this "justice system." But I sadly don't think any of this will change anything and I believe it is a mistake to think that paying more money to lawyers is what will free samourai. This whole case was fucked from the beginning and there is nothing the lawyers could do to change that except just waste more time while the samouai team rots in jail. They have already been locked up for far too long and the damage has already been done. The courts succeeded in what they intended to do all along: scare developers.
↩ replying to Deleted Account
You're suggesting a hodlr won't spend something that they need to spend in order to continue living/functioning? I'm not trying to argue with you, but I really don't think there's a big difference between saving and maximum saving. Either you save or you don't save. There are varying degrees depending on personal sacrifice tolerance and debt/income ratio but saying hodling is retarded sounds extra retarded coming from someone named stackthecorn. It almost seems like a bandwagoning comment to simp for Lola rather than sticking to your ideals which you have displayed with your username in the past. So were you lying then or lying now? She's promoting shitcoins and dissing bitcoiners, while getting zapped for it and never contributing back or sending zaps in return. The contradiction is strong with this one. I've spent many sats in the last year and a half while hodling as much as I deem possible given my current situation. We live in a world with many currencies, but one currency is rising and showing itself as the best. She said she would get lynched in her note, so she knew there would be controversy when she wrote it. She gets paid to contrive these rage debates. Bitcoiners simping for her is pathetic.
Congrats on the grant. It's ok to work shitcoin related stuff, but I don't think you need to combine it with attempted bitcoin shaming. Every time someone tries to say that there isn't enough bitcoin spending going on, it's like, who are you even talking to? This is nostr. As far as I can tell, we're at the forefront of V4V with bitcoin. To anyone who is actually on the bitcoin standard, all they hear is "you have money, I don't, you should give me yours". Just like atlas shrugged. Maybe you need to stop hanging out with the "orange tie suits" so much. I don't see bitcoin through this lens at all. I also never really hated shitcoins, they're doing their thing, that's great, maybe something good comes out of it, maybe not. Twitter is the only reason everyone 'went to war' over this stuff in the first place afaict, just influencoors obeying the algos to popularize being toxic to each other. Again, congrats. I enjoy your takes for the most part and think it's cool that there are real journalists covering this stuff.
This is surprising to me. My experience with bitcoiners is that they tend be very generous, with the notable exception of MSTR and penny stock promoters. With your ETH donations, were they all from wealthy holders or the Ethereum Foundation? That would speak less to the culture within Ethereum community itself and more to the fact that those with the biggest pre-mined bags feared the Tornado Cash trial would become an existential threat to Ethereum's existence.
It could also be that the Samurai guys were kinda dicks. They also (apparently) have a large personal stash. If someone has over 100 or 1000 bitcoin it makes donating more difficult. I agree that bitcoiners can do a lot better in this area.
I think most actual Bitcoiners already know the government is shit. Bitcoiners understand what values them. We pay for our own values. Bitcoiners would more likely pay to see documentaries in person after it’s already made. At Bitcoin conferences around the world. I would! My company would most likely sponsor the showing. I would love to see a production of the samurai story.
I respectfully disagree with this take. I've done more than 400 livestreams over two years all focused on growing Bitcoin adoption and helping Bitcoiners protect their sats The entire journey has been funded by the community. We have no sponsors and have no plans of changing that. I believe that maintaining one's voice - without influence of sponsors - is most important in this space. There are a ton of INCREDIBLY generous and supportive Bitcoiners out there. The community has allowed me to wake up every day and talk about Bitcoin. Could it be better? Of course. I feel like I should have 100,000 viewers on the livestreams every morning - strictly because of how exciting and important Bitcoin is. God bless all the people who have and continue to support the channel. You know who you are - and I would not be here without you 🧑
L0la L33tz's avatar L0la L33tz
We just got a pretty major grant from a thing called Octant and the Ethereum Foundation to produce a documentary about the DOJβ€˜s case against Roman Storm. Probably gonna get lynched for this, but I think we need to talk. While we are grateful for every donation, over the past ~1.5 years we received noticably less donations in Bitcoin than we received in ETH, Zcash and Monero over the course of just a few months - while our main audience *are* bitcoiners. The only way I can explain this to myself is that there seems to be an issue with the general mentality of trying to keep your bitcoin to yourself, which results in a significant lack of support for others - and it makes me really sad. The way the Ethereum community is supporting the tornado cash developers is nothing short of extraordinary. Compare that to our support of Samourai, who collected a mere few 100k, while Roman Storm raised millions to fund his case. At the same time we end up wondering why most people in bitcoin are retarded orange tie maxis that treat BTC like just another stonk, and why its use as a tool for the people falls more and more behind in the global narrative. Its time we start taking better care of each other in this space, and I hope that next time one of us is criminally indicted, we support them with all that we have.
View quoted note →
Hard Money is a winner take all game. The bar to give some of it away is much higher than petty losers like you can currently create things. Keep working, we pay for things we value, maybe you’ll create something we value one day. We won’t be shamed into giving up Bitcoin though.
while you seem to be doing important and quality work, it's a bit hard to expect people to send money as support when it's not clear what or who the money funds. You want donations, you need to display transparency, governance and accountability. ETH foundation giving you shitcoins is on the same level as some billionnaire giving to a charity money that evaded tax and will be used to deduce yet more tax --> an absurd cynical move, stealing from the mass to appear generous and morally righteous
The amount of negative comments in this thread with GFY and blaming for "shitcoining" is a sign of deep brain rot. It's one thing to caution newbies about buying alts. It's a completely different thing to believe that only btc is money, while denying reality of alts being used as money, including in donations/investments in our own social layer - journalists, lobbyists, human rights activists. The former is wise, the later is idiotic.
What bothers me about this note is that I see so many high-profile Nostr users calling out to the community for help so many times. But when I take their npubs and put them into @npub1sx9r...6g8m, it seems like they never zap. Lola, as much as I respect your work, you've received 4 million zaps but haven't sent even 1,000. I make a shitty podcast, and I have an average income. And I zapped way more than you did with a low-key profile here on Nostr. If @ODELL or @Marty Bent called me for zaps, I'd usually zap! I will do as you do, not as you say! Don't get me wrong! I admire your work. But don't you think that other things on Nostr are valuable, too? I hate to be the snitch, but... It's our job! Remember: Don't trust, verify! https://nostr.band/npub1mznweuxrjm423au6gjtlaxmhmjthvv69ru72t335ugyxtygkv3as8q6mak?overview=zaps-sent
↩ replying to Sven
So you have evidence, you just don't believe it. The influencers in this space have become extraordinarily skilled at grifting while wearing shirt and tie or whatever clownsuit gets the masses to support them. She can sit and make broad, sweeping accusations and insults about "what most people are" but she can't answer your question honestly without breaking character. That's what she is. A character. A paid one.
↩ replying to Sven
Hi Sven, thanks for the engagement. Going by your post stating that you have an "average income," seeing on your profile that you are a father, and additionally seeing how you describe your own podcast as "shitty," I take it that your podcast is not how you pay your bills or provide for your family, and that you have another source of income. This may come as a total surprise to you Sven, but some people out here do not contribute to the bitcoin space as a hobby, but as a full time job – which includes taking a massive amount of risk, which you, again going by your own statements, do not appear to have been willing to take. No shame in that, but maybe a good time to check your privilege and see whether that really puts you in a position to judge those who have. I, and I am sure many other creators you are referencing in your post here, actually live off of bitcoin; Zaps are not some fun way to boost engagement for us, but another way to pay our bills. Contrary to you, we support the bitcoin ecosystem and services/projects we find valuable every time we spend our money, not by sending someone 2 cents on a tipping protocol. You're free to disagree with that, but I hope it helps you understand where many of the creators you are referencing here are likely coming from.
↩ replying to L0la L33tz
Took the liberty to paste your npub into nostrband as well here, Sven. Going by these stats, you spent 86k sats in the ~one year of your nostr journey. Seeing how you equate zapping to supporting the ecosystem, I'll assume that this is the primary way for you to spend your bitcoin for things that you find valuable (please correct me if I'm wrong). To clear up any misconceptions, and not to brag but to maybe put things into perspective for you from the position of someone who lives off bitcoin, I've spent more than five times that amount of sats today alone supporting projects/services/people that are valuable to me, simply because bitcoin is what I use as a day-to-day currency. So Sven, please do get back to me when you can have a serious conversation about supporting other bitcoiners, and until then maybe try not to judge other people by how active they are in your favorite way of giving back, because that doesnt mean they dont.
↩ replying to L0la L33tz
Lola, After you received so many negative comments here, I wanted to be polite in my response, yet still point out the inconsistency of your questioning the willingness of others to donate while not donating on Nostr yourself. (At least, not visibly on Nostr.) Since neither of us knows how much BTC the other has spent outside of Nostr, I just pointed out Nostr. I can't verify your claim that you paid 400k sats today, and I don't actually care if it's true. (Maybe you have a spending problem and not a donation problem?) My whole point was about the projects and its value on Nostr. Just the things we can see. Proof of work, not proof of word. But now that you're bringing up the typical American "check your privilege" nonsense bullshit, you've lost me. No one is forcing you to work on a donation system. No one forces you to work for Bitcoin β€” whatever that means. Bitcoin doesn't care if you exist. It doesn't care about me either. If you think it's a hobby of mine, that's fine. Then I'll say it's a hobby of yours as well since, as far as I know, you're not a core developer or a coder. But if you think receiving regular payments is a privilege, then go work at McDonald's! Go and claim your own privilege!
↩ replying to Sven
So your primary source of income - which from what I gather is as a state employed teacher - Ill assume is not paid in bitcoin. And you started this conversation trying to measure how people give back to the bitcoin ecosystem what they receive by what I pointed out as a complete nonsense metric when compared to people who live on bitcoin, like those creators you pointed out. Which lets you resort to β€žget a job at mcdonalds if you want regular paymentsβ€œ - which you presumably typed on a computer funded with someone elses tax money, written from an apartment funded with someone elses tax money, bitching about bitcoin you bought with someone elses tax money. Mmh yeah I think Im done here lmao. Thanks Sven!
Wokecoiners. Some bitcoiners like to echo "stay humble" and love to front the prophecy about the Bitcoin economy and the Bitcoin standart but that's just virtue signaling to the group, masking their private intentions. Uuh you said the right thing, you got the zaps, the likes, you're a big boy bitcoiner now! Watch the same people turn on each other and act like entitled brats and bitches immediately after when somebody argues for a different bitcoin implementation. You won the game of Bitcoin, you lost in life, wokecoiner. I love my corn and I couldn't care less what the rest of you think. I do this for my own benefit. If Bitcoin's game theory lured me in by that desire and uses me to benefit others, that's just a testimony to why I love Bitcoin. It outsmarts me and my personal F, U & D with fairness and stoicism. Well played. Still: Bitcoin is not an identity. Bitcoiners who only talk bitcoin suck balls. View quoted note β†’