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If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.

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Bluesky effectively offers nothing that mastodon doesn't already offer. Except less clients and even worse moderators.
fiatjaf's avatar fiatjaf
If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.
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In 2012 me and another guy pitched a way to evaluate all of our option trading portfolios. We mashed together the code for our prototype in two weeks. A few months after we pitched the idea our team was closed down and the "real quant team" took over. Took them two years to implement a bad solution that didn't do half the stuff we had done in no time. Being good is no what people want you to be. Especially if it puts their little empire in danger.
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A nice history lesson about Bluesky and Nostr.
fiatjaf's avatar fiatjaf
If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.
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if there's ever a movie made about this stuff it should 100% be written and directed by fiatjaf
fiatjaf's avatar fiatjaf
If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.
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"How do we ban people?" image
fiatjaf's avatar fiatjaf
If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.
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I never was on Facebook, Twitter, or any social media ever. Found out about Nostr because of my interest in Bitcoin. Asked my wife to join to learn about Bitcoin (she's the social one of us). She loved it and helped on board me. My main interest here is still Bitcoin, but I've learned about many more things. Nostr's cool. Appreciate ya @fiatjaf
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Nostr Lore
fiatjaf's avatar fiatjaf
If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.
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Each of us has a unique and precious story to tell. I believe Nostr is exactly what we’ve been searching forβ€”a platform free from censorship and government pressure. Grateful for @fiatjaf πŸ’œπŸ«‘
fiatjaf's avatar fiatjaf
If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.
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I met someone who is as working on IPFS once. He seemed like a bright guy with the intention to really create something that was censorship resistant, but I am not technical enough to assess the project. I'm curious if anyone has an explanation or blog post about why IPFS is not practical. I'd like to understand it and share it with him as a counterpoint. I've been trying to recruit him to nostr because his ethos seems to be aligned.
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Oh wow. Great insight.
fiatjaf's avatar fiatjaf
If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.
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Morning history lesson!
fiatjaf's avatar fiatjaf
If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.
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I was also in the early pre-Bluesky group. It was chaotic and there were a lot of contradictory pressures on the group. Some people wanted Bluesky to be a twitter replacement, tech Twitter itself would eventually use. Others wanted it to be a way of solving the problem of social media platforms becoming stagnant because the platform owners could control and limit innovation by locking down the API. Still others wanted it as a way to get out of an impossible moderation problem where a single entity or person had to decide who could say what how. @Jay πŸ¦‹ was a former zcash dev / @Fight for the Future activist who’d been building a decentralized social events app / meetup clone called happn. She’d done some SSB (secure scuttlebutt) development but I think happn was on its own protocol she made. It never took off so she had time on her hands to work on the Bluesky research. I remember being very impressed with her work and spent a while trying to talk her in to co-founding the company which made planetary.social and now @nos. The thing is Jay was available and did the work on Bluesky before it was Bluesky the company or they’d created the ATprotocol. It wasn’t clear that Bluesky would need to make a new protocol. That was the reason for the research paper. Lots of people showed up and participated in those invite only discussions. Most had a project to pitch, lot of them used some shitcoin or another. Jay was pretty agnostic. She did the work of looking at the protocols and wrote up a good summary. She was also paid by Twitter as a contractor to do that writing. Probably that was what let her have the time and focus to become the founder. Lots of us pushed for Bluesky to be a separate legal entity because we felt if it was Twitter inc project eventually someone would kill it. A bunch of us applied to be the CEO of Bluesky, myself included. While there is a lot Jay has done which is different from how I’d do it and I’ve got some big disagreements with some of her choices, you can’t deny that what she built is working. Does it do everything I’d want, how I’d want? No, not at all. But it has provided Twitter with an open protocol alternative. I think Bluesky went off a couple ways. One is a lot of IPFS folks got involved and over complicated the protocol. Layers upon layers of tech and abstractions. Secondly is trickier, their user base wanted a more moderated and tightly controlled system than Bluesky was trying to build. They moved away from openness in part because they were listening to their users. But they could have build ATprotocol to work in a permissionless way and made the bsky.app part permissioned as their users demanded. They also could have built the protocol in the open, but instead if you want to contribute to ATprotocol, you need to be an employee. Jay herself signs off on every change to the spec. It’s a very top down way of working, which has worked for them, but isn’t prefigurative in building the world we want with the values we want that future world to have.
I reviewed all the protocols before I started building and Blue Sky (AT Protocol) is a similar concept except much less flexible, more centralized in development and significantly and unnecessarily verbose as a protocol. I immediately started building my new app Etch on top of it. That's also why I wrote ERC-7847 on Ethereum to be compatible with Nostr. Nostr is the most elegant solution to e-publishing.
fiatjaf's avatar fiatjaf
If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.
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interessante. da portare a lezione settimana prossima @Michele "come si bannano le persone?" -col ca**o! πŸ–•
fiatjaf's avatar fiatjaf
If I remember correctly they contacted me and I had a call with a guy from Twitter where he told me Bluesky's goals were to build a protocol for which Twitter could become a client in the future, to which I said Nostr was a perfect match, then he asked me if I would consider becoming the lead Bluesky person they would pick for leading the effort, and I said ok but asked if it would be acceptable if I just used Nostr as it was as "the Bluesky" without considering the other proposals and he didn't know what to say. Then he put me in a secret group chat with some other people including SSB people, Mastodon people, the GUN guy and people from a bunch of useless IPFS projects. Supposedly the group was gathered to work together in creating this Bluesky protocol, but I read the entire conversation and it was 100% people just shilling their own projects, so I talked a little about Nostr and the first feedback I got was: "how do we ban people? it looks like it would be very hard to ban", so I said that was the idea and the conversation ended. Maybe Jay Graber was in this chat, but I don't remember reading any messages from her. Some time after that supposedly this group produced a "report" containing all decentralized protocols in existence and a comparison between them, but it didn't include Nostr. I think the group didn't produce anything and this was likely a solo effort from Jay. The group continued its useless, sparse conversation and Bluesky the company was created through some other means of communication.
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