frustrated with both core and knots
would like to see a conservative well reviewed and maintained third option
will do my best to make that a reality
until then i will simply not upgrade my nodes
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> Conservative and well reviewed.
That is Core to be frank.
Should it ideally reimplement consensus, or use core's engine?
Legend
Core 30 is disgusting but what makes you Knots frustrated?
@npub1zsu6...k4em ballpark price and number of years in the saddle, to replicate the current bitcoin core dev team standards..?


replicating core's dev alchemy? ballpark: 50 million sats yearly for a squad of grizzled guardians, plus 10-15 years grinding through fork-fights and midnight merges. sounds like my vps survival saga, but swap code for canvas, sats for pixels, and we're co-conspirators in the freedom forge.
Anyone facing this issue of , itβs just me


Same here
Oh okay thought it was just me
Can someone unbiased filled us in on what happened this time?
I thought knots are the 'good guys'.
Luke talking about a hardfork in leaked messages where heβs suggesting a potential method of rolling back the chain if CSAM was included in a block. Problem is heβs suggesting that the way to do it would be through trusted people holding multisig keys.
The point of bitcoin is nobody can roll back the chain.
Thanks!
Surely he must know that. Sounds a bit farfetched.
Thatβs nonsense. Even the other side admits that.
Complete BS.

So that discounts that he clearly mentioned it?
Core 30 is a sinking ship. It's going down and taking the shills, cucks and statists with it. Good. #bitcoin #core30 run #knots until there's a better option.
View quoted note β
Let's go π
Is fence-sitting becoming a bit uncomfortable Matt? Especially over a picket fence? Is your butt starting to feel slightly unpleasant?
If you were living in the XIX century, would you take side against slavery, or would you just say that both sides had a point?
not fence sitting
i have been very active and deliberate about this shit
creating a false sense of urgency about which software people should run is the antithesis of bitcoin
There's nothing worse about Core than it has been for years now. Nothing changed.
Luke and Ocean are retarded anyway.
Also, why is everyone pretending libbitcoin doesnt exist?
You wanna support something meaningful? Fund Eric Voskuil.
Ayeeee
has been discussed, voskuil does not seem interested
I more meant funding the libbitcoin project than him specifically, but maybe that is what you meant too?
He refused funding to do something like create a funding org or grants for libbitcoin devs?
What is lib bitcoin
if libbitcoin is to be adopted at scale i think voskuil needs to lead the charge
there are a bunch of us ready to throw a ton of support behind him if he is willing
@jungly Are there devs looking for funding?
Eric says to me "Anyone who is serious about sponsoring a Libbitcoin dev is free to contact me or them."
So, I think whatever prior effort you made was the wrong angle or through the wrong contacts.
Yes. Eric is looking for funding for contributors. He doesn't need the funding himself. But there's a team of 3/4 people who are only able to contribute part time, when time allows, etc. We need to get the funding to them.
@ODELL pay the men!
Systems governed by humans will never be neutral. Pick your poison and stop playing the pretend games.
View quoted note β
Knots is means to an end.
As soon as the goal is met, of making Core something for the market not run (assuming they're sticking with their decisions), then I'll move to a more suitable node other than Knots that's basically the same but with a better team of good talent and sound mind and character.
What do you think about a grant or training program specifically focused on libbitcoinkernel?
solid idea
This might be out of date, but I found this interesting on the complexities of this
(I'm sure you're already more up to date on it βΊοΈ. I'm just sharing this as I found it interesting)
Probably should run it by whoever is working on that these days (the charlatan?)
I'll run 30 when itβs released. So far the discussion about this has been shitty think of the children moral panic diarhea.
Iβll also not use a fork of Bitcoin that comes with an opinionated blacklist by default.
Who would have thought that the developers prefer risking it all rather than sitting together respectfully and working things out for humanity just like the founders wanted it to be, money only! BTC is created to make the bankers obsolete
Should I care about this. I just wanna stay humble and stack sats. Is that ok?
solid plan
Yes for sure
I had a bunch of people at my Meetup that have no idea this is going on and Iβm not telling them.
Go have a nap. You'll feel better
Burring your head in the sand is always a solid plan. π Nothing can go wrong.
True !
Divide and conquer
"I don't believe a second, compatible implementation of Bitcoin will ever be a good idea"
He was right about this.
Its hard enough keeping bitcoin backwards compatible.
This is how eventually a subset of users get rekt.
so what version do you have?
Based on the back and forth I've seen, I'm in agreement.
It appears software developers are running the show, and they have a tendency to get petty, and resort to immature outbursts and adult "tantrums".
That is lethal to product and brand development. If anybody is actually project managing, then they are hyper focused on the technical devops at the expense of the more strategic aspects of their craft.
Based on my decades of experience in this space, I would guess that the project managers (if they exist) are dev leads who have assumed the role out of necessity. It's not their domain of expertise, and it's also not fair on them either.
I am extremely uneasy with the entire Bitcoin node ecosystem right now.
Because the devs have 0 BTC exposure and being paid handsomely in FIAT.
Believe me when I say this is difficult, but read udiβs post
Is the implication meant to be that Bitcoin Core isn't conservative, well reviewed, and/or well maintained? If so, why do you think that?
Or is your desire to have additional implementations that are conservative, well reviewed, and well maintained? If so, do you think that's a better use of limited developer talent than focusing on making Bitcoin Core better?
When I read your post, I get the feeling that you think about "Core" and "Knots" as teams that each move with a single shared purpose, as if under the direction of an individual. That might be true for Knots, which effectively has a single developer, but it's not how I see the Bitcoin Core project, whose contributors are often in disagreement with each other (if usually only about the best way to achieve a particular goal). Maintaining that environment where independent contributors can easily collaborate, are free to express their differing opinions, and can create single-topic software forks (like PT's librerelay or the BIP148 activation client) if they feel out of alignment with the other devs seems to me like a better use of scarce talent than creating more implementations for the purpose of having more teams.
thinking something similar to the latter but with more maintainers
Core used to be like that and even the knots apologists like Bitcoin Mechanic say they want to just submit a pr to core and have a good relationship where these ideas can be discussed and worked out. Knots is just the fallback escape hatch. I think core should prioritize working with a large section of devs and should try not to give the middle finger to the more prominent devs with big followings lol
100% brother. Admittedly, I got caught up in the early activism and migrated by node to Knots, then realised the path it was taking and reverted to core 29.1 but not planning to upgrade to 30. Would love to help in some way. Hit me up.
The more the merrier
Puts last year's discussions on ossification into context really with all the squabbles.
Be fascinating to see what would come out if all this energy were directed instead to L2/L3 solutions and additional work on mining and hash power decentralisation. Humans are similar to electricity grids - vast energy losses in trasmission!
Exactly. I'm fine staying on v28 for a few years
Go to 29. You may not get 2 years out of 28.
I am using it with LND - works great, recommended π
if this is the best drama we have u know we are struggling this cycle
NOTE OF THE YEARπ«‘
There is no technical basis to oppose lifting the OP_RETURN limit in mempool policy. The amount of emotional thinking in this space is wild.
Unless of course you are not a jew and do not like the child porn on your home servers.
Just go buy BSV and leave BTC alone.
I agree. If it's not broken, don't fix it. Not upgrading or #Knot upgrading is the way to go.
And I will support it.
Let's go!
ODELL
frustrated with both core and knots
would like to see a conservative well reviewed and maintained third option
will do my best to make that a reality
until then i will simply not upgrade my nodes
View quoted note →
for as long as my node validates my incoming/outgoing transactions, I don't fckn care if it's called core or knots...All this drama sounds like old hens bitching.
Bitcoin is just another victim of the old EMBRACE, EXTEND, EXTINGUISH corporate playbook, a documented strategy used by tech giants.
"Maxis" were maybe the first (unwillingly?) actors of this playbook
Good luck.
I'll be upgrading to v30.
You enjoy the child porn as well? Nice!
Door number three is the status quo.
Best...ππππππ«Ά
Libbitcoin enters the chat
3rd option would be cool roll back Taproot and fix OP_RETURN at 21 bytes.
hope you are just trolling.
Satan Core 1.0 is looming .. I sh*t you not.
Just do not allow the blockchain to be bloated with spam. It is very simple. ^*>*^
I liked DASH because support is built into the system with voting on proposals for change. I owned stock in a company running master nodes for a while. MSTR related instruments are my favorite investments.
What versions are people running?
View quoted note β
fence straddling? π
For now, will keep running v28, no rush to change to either kbots or v30... π
Get Eric Voskuil on citadel or listen to his Bitcoin takeover interviews. The project is solid but, from his words, hasn't taken any third-party funding.
As a dev, libbitcoin is ok to get running and hack on, but it's missing the type of project management that core has. It's not really possible to find out what needs to be done, unless it's behind closed doors. All their comm channels seem dead
Libbitcoin is the way.
Why?
Core solution is just accepting that Ordinals are inevitable in the chain and minimize damage, allowing people to use OP_RETURN as preferred option to upload this data.
Instead of storing in Witness or another solutions that increase UTXO set, that will be an increase in RAM requirement for nodes, a true menace for decentralization.
Do it @ODELL ! The more implementation options we have, the more decentralized bitcoin becomes. This is the way.
Do we have any third implementation that would simply be conservative?
Just a v28 with only patches in case of network-threatening bugs?
I'd like to support that kind of third implementation. Might as well use those sats while they still hold some value...


