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core devs now have to: - deal with legal threats - deal with threats from social media brigades run by 2023-era "bitcoin maxi" influencers - soul crushing and time consuming rebasing and code review - have deep knowledge of complex cryptographic protocols, engineering and economics who would want to work on bitcoin at this point? what's the point? to defend the network just to be attacked by lawers and angry mobs?

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Just some thoughts... not hate. - deal with legal threats What are they doing that could land them in court? Actions always have consequences. A shit poster online saying they're going to take you to court online isn't a threat (If they're even real and not bots). When the paperwork shows up then it's a "threat". Maybe they should consider that they could be on the wrong side of the law/issue. - deal with threats from social media brigades run by 2023-era "bitcoin maxi" influencers. Again what threats? I only sasee the odd over the top person, most people just don't want non-monetary stuff. Sorry to hear if people or bots are sending threatening messages, it's bullshit. I hope you don't consider the people who understand a lot of topics, including incentives and technical details and are willing to put their thoughts out there, noise. Seems that core devs aren't really listening to some of the deeper arguments. I see a lot of pro-core devs/people saying its a bunch of noise, but then they don't even counter the points given. Just because someone is new to bitcoin doesn't mean they don't understand or haven't done their homework. - soul crushing and time consuming rebasing and code review What? You choose what's worth doing. How does this not apply to any other project, especially project that is voluntary? There is always grunt work to be done, but you do it because it's worthwhile. - have deep knowledge of complex cryptographic protocols, engineering and economics Devs didn't need to have this before? I would hope understanding the project deeply would be a requirement when you're making decisions for it, especially when they can have large consequences for a monetary network of people's savings. Many of the core devs think people commenting on these issues need to be super enlightened, so why wouldn't the core devs need this too? We all have things to learn, that's why we use others to give feedback. I can understand being new and helping out with minor fixes and features, but when it comes to policy and far reaching changes, you'd better know your stuff and trying to figure out how it's going to effect things in the future. We have an incredible pool of talent, so use it.
At the end of the day I thought anyone could run any version they want. The point is no one group deciding anything, be it core, knots, miners, traders, governments, etc. What’s nice about bitcoin is that eventually the problems will flush out and be addressed. Everyone attacking or insisting one way or the other is fighting an unnecessary battle. Knots guys run knots, core guys run core, LTS guys run v24, some weirdos running version 1. And why can’t code suggestions and contributions be anonymous or psuedononymous? People can run sandbox versions, have AI look at it, and use what they want from it. It’s open source, run and modify whatever you want. Am I missing something?
I didn't knots people cared about credentialism, but I guess thats fair. so here are mine. there are ~1234 contributors to bitcoin. in terms of raw contributions mine would be 188/1234: https://cdn.jb55.com/s/4104d140cd815d77.txt#:~:text=William%20Casarin If adam has contributed he must be doing it under a nym since I don't see any commits from him. my commits: πŸ“ƒ.txt I worked on usdt tracing and performance optimizations. I am by no means a frequent contributor, I mainly work on lightning tech. things I've worked on: core-lightning: πŸ“ƒ.txt lnsocket - a C/rust library for talking to lightning network nodes btcs - a bitcoin toy bitcoin script interpreter bitcointap - A tool for tapping into bitcoin-core tracepoints to extract data in realtime: opentimestamps: i put together the haskell implementation of ots, and built a suite of tools that work with them: I maintain the "bitcoin" nodejs rpc lib: https://npmrepo.com/bitcoin I've hacked on HWI and helped with a lot of the bitcoin-nix infrastructure. I've also been around since 2010 and have a decent understanding how various parts of the codebase work, especially on the script side. what about you?
> its just relaxing the filters to what is actually reflected in the protocol rules. Which is the max block size. > the less accurate your node is when doing fee estimation. I never had a substantial discrepancy in fee estimates. I don't think there are many new attack vectors introduced by these changes but still, as good practice, no upgrading to newer versions before they have been out for a prolonged time. It surely will lead to a cleaner code, that I agree.
Given below is a try at unbiased assessment of the perspectives from both sides. A nuanced approach is key here, no need to attack and belittle each other.
ManyKeys's avatar ManyKeys
OP_RETURN Data Carrier Size Removal: Technical and Legal Risks
Increasing Bitcoin's OP_RETURN data carrier size from 80 bytes up to ~4 MB per block (Bitcoin Core v30) brings new technical and legal risksβ€”especially regarding liability for illicit dataβ€”alongside a drive toward network standardization and transparency. This analysis weighs both sides, highlighting the debate between critics warning about centralization pressures and developer advocates focused on protocol realities and censorship resistance.
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I hate this victim mentality like core contributors are paupers. Why work on it? If they're smart, the average Core dev has tens of millions in bitcoin at this point. They should protect their biggest asset. And regardless of how you feel about this particular filters issue, they made numerous unforced errors with the way they rolled out and communicated the change. I hate to say it but this is why corporations use project managers and product people. Insulate engineers from public facing comments. Putting your foot your mouth can wreck a project - even FOSS.
Playing the victim card is pathetic. The expectation that core devs can do whatever they want without any negative response from node runners shows how inconsequential you think Bitcoin is. This isn't your average, sleepy foss project with a few hundred users who all completely trust the devs. This is the most important foss project in history and the behavior of core recently has been unbelievably irresponsible. I don't condone the worst behavior, but sadly this will always be present on the internet. So either accept that reality or work on something else. And maybe try listening to your users instead of insulting them.
If reviewing code for #bitcoin is "soul-crushing" to you, that's probably a clear signal that you should step aside. stick to nostr apps or whatever actually gives you a sense of meaning. Perhaps also it is soul crushing for you because you and the Core devs are deliberately violating established and necessary principles of mempool filters to protect our beloved timechain, against the clear wishes of our community. Maybe listen to that feeling inside and change course. You make it sound like having deep knowledge is a burden. If it's not for you, please step aside and follow your purpose whatever it is
I wish all well, I felt terrible sorry to hear that core dev get legal threats ! Thats not fair , after all the hard work and contributions to the development and end up like this . You right . If things not getting better , who wants to Work at BTC project at this point ?
Lmao bitcoin != core poor opensource developer "team"
jb55's avatar jb55
core devs now have to: - deal with legal threats - deal with threats from social media brigades run by 2023-era "bitcoin maxi" influencers - soul crushing and time consuming rebasing and code review - have deep knowledge of complex cryptographic protocols, engineering and economics who would want to work on bitcoin at this point? what's the point? to defend the network just to be attacked by lawers and angry mobs?
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